"LJ909" (lj909) 07/08/2020 at 22:21 • Filed to: Cadillac, Cadillac CT5, 2020 Cadillac CT5

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A guy a block down from my job has a brand new Cadillac CT5 Sport exactly like the one pictured. As we know, they changed their naming and it has the engines torque in NM on the back, so it has a 350T badge. Its parked on the street every day near a 7Eleven I go in for a lot of time in the mornings. This morning I asked him how he liked it. He said its good but not as good as he was expecting. I asked him why. He said “It feels down on power. You’d think with it having a 350 horse turbo engine it would have more get up and go.” I asked him who or where did he get the info that this thing had 350 horses. He says “It says it on the back look.” as he motions me to follow him to the back of the car so he can show me the 350T badge. “I would’ve got the trim with 550 horses but who’s going to use that much stuck on the 405 in traffic?!” (his NY accent made it more funny. He told me before he moved to LA about 10 years ago because he needed “some sun”. His words.)

I say “ Sooo you’re telling me that one of the reasons you got this car was because you were sold on the idea that it had 350 horses?” His face changes as I ask him this and he says “yea why, whats the problem? The sales guy told me that this was the one I wanted if the 550 horses was too much.” I proceeded to tell him that the dealer, a nearby dealer in Torrance, was full of shit, and had no idea what they were talking about. I then tried to explain how Caddy had changed their naming scheme, and that that number on the back was a rating in Newton Meters of torque. He hadn’t even heard of NM nor knew it was a thing outside the US. He was disappointed to find that he only had 237 horses.

TL;DR: Cadillac sales people are idiots and are apparently telling customers that the NM torque rating on the back of their cars is horsepower, and customers are clueless and don’t understand the new naming scheme and are dumb as hell. 

WilliamsSW > LJ909 07/08/2020 at 22:51

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That’s stupid on so many levels, I’m not sure I can list them all.

But the biggest one to me is JUST TEST DRIVE THE DAMN CAR AND SEE IF IT FEELS QUICK ENOUGH.  THE NUMBERS DON'T MEAN SHIT.

CB > LJ909 07/08/2020 at 22:52

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That is unsurprising and depressing.

404 - User No Longer Available > LJ909 07/08/2020 at 22:56

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It used to be that Cadillac dealers were fairly exclusive and a level above both the red and blue GM dealers. Recently I found out that the Chevy dealer where I bought my Sol started selling Cadillacs. T hat Chevy dealer looks very run down, their service area looks like a wooden shed.

I guess this was Johan’s idea of rebuilding Cadillac’s image and probably why he was fired.

LJ909 > WilliamsSW 07/08/2020 at 23:02

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Exactly. There’ s so many people (a nd this dude the times I’ve talked to him came across as one) that are faux car guys and get sold on stupid shit its crazy. He either didn’ t test drive it or he wasn’t paying attention.

way2blu does a rev update > LJ909 07/08/2020 at 23:09

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I maintain that if GM just rebadged all the Cadillacs under some new brand, and put together a competent marketing campaign, that they’d sell significantly better.

The “grandparent car” stereotype is so deeply ingrained in the US market that no “Cadillac” besides the Escalade will ever be as popular as a BMW or Mercedes-Benz.

WilliamsSW > LJ909 07/08/2020 at 23:10

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Probably test drove it by babying it.   

LJ909 > 404 - User No Longer Available 07/08/2020 at 23:16

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My experience from when I sold GM products were that yes, a lot of Cadillac dealers were exclusive and a level above the other divisions, but this was nothing but on the surface. A lot of the dealerships I encountered in the past had the same slime ass snake sales people that just came to Cadillac simply because they figured there was more money to be made. And the customers, mostly the old clientele that Cadillac is desperately trying to get away from, have grown accustomed to how these people are and don’t bat an eye at the shittiness as they always get “taken care of”, i.e. they are old money, they come in every few years to get a new XTS or Escalade and chit chat with the sales manager or sales person for about 45 mins before leaving with no hassle. Stuff like this just proves they aren’t doing shit right anymore than the Chevy dealer trying to convince a soccer mom that AWD is standard on a base Traverse.

Cadillac really has no idea what they are doing.

LJ909 > way2blu does a rev update 07/08/2020 at 23:22

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Yea at this point I think they should just own that older people like them and go with it, and try to build on that Standard of the World image. Them trying going back and forth between being a brand they arent and copying those getting it right doesnt work.

LJ909 > WilliamsSW 07/08/2020 at 23:23

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He either works from home or does something that doesn’t require him to work much because I’m at work all day and its always in the same place.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > WilliamsSW 07/08/2020 at 23:25

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I was genuinely surprised to learn my car only has 136 horsepower. It feels like a few more horses under the hood and that's all I care about. 

PS9 > LJ909 07/08/2020 at 23:39

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I have no sympathy for this guy. 'Cadillac CT5 V-Sport' into google would have given him all the information he needed in like a second. He's smart enough to position himself to buy a luxury car, he can take a moment to learn a tiny bit of critical info about it. 

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > LJ909 07/09/2020 at 01:15

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You’re not the bad guy, but consider leaving people in their ignorance especially after money changes hands.

The gal who used to cut my  hair traded in her car for a new Renegade. I gave her my congrats and asked her which trim and whatnot. At the end she punctuated that, "The best part is it's a Jeep! It's really just a mini-Wrangler!!!" I smiled and said, "Yeah!" I wasn't about to explain FCA, Pandas, and unibody to someone who just dropped serious dough because of badge-engineering.

LJ909 > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 07/09/2020 at 01:24

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Yea in the instance you provided I would’ve left well enough alone. But after having spoken to this guy a few times I thought he was a car guy and knew his shit. Apparently not though.

haveacarortwoorthree2 > LJ909 07/09/2020 at 07:50

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Go slap a Bentley badge on it and tell him he now has a much better car. Or, better yet, put a Lambo badge on it and set it on fire - then he can tell everyone he had a Lambo. lol

WilliamsSW > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available 07/09/2020 at 07:59

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How the engine makes power, how much it weighs, and gearing are all big factors, too.

136 horsepower can be a lot of fun in a light car. 

Under_Score > LJ909 07/09/2020 at 08:37

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Meanwhile, you have the Scat Pack. The badge says 392, but it really makes 485 HP. Now THAT’S a surprise.

Speed > PS9 07/09/2020 at 08:39

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This. I almost feel bad for the chap, but it appears he didn’t do the least amount of research. Good thing he didn’t walk into a Fiat dealer and look at 500's.

“How did that Shelby beat my Fiat!? He only has 350 horsepower!!!!

Speed > WilliamsSW 07/09/2020 at 08:42

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Indeed they don’t. I’ve taken a CTS-V wagon down the track and while the speedometer indicated I was moving along quickly, the feeling wasn’t there. It’s a hell of a cruiser and family car, but if I’m h00 ning I’d rather take my 345 horse ‘98 Z28 or my old ‘95 Mustang GT with half the horsepower and twice the drama.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > WilliamsSW 07/09/2020 at 09:07

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Exactly, though 3,000 lbs does mean every horse is a little overworked.

WilliamsSW > Speed 07/09/2020 at 09:10

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The more insulated and heavy the car is, the less of a sense of speed you'll get.   I'm sure those pony cars are far more visceral than the Caddy is.

Milky > LJ909 07/09/2020 at 09:34

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Clearly I’m here  and in the industry and I didn’t even know they were NM badges on the back of their cars. What a stupid metric to use for an American company. Yea he could have googled and yea the dealer is also stupid but why did they switch to that?

I actually really liked the old 2.0T, 3.6, 3.0TT, 4.2TT badges. They were the most sensible ones around.

WilliamsSW > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available 07/09/2020 at 10:02

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I’ve had my E46 convertible for 20 years. 168 horsepower and probably 3500 lb or so.

But it has short gearing, a manual transmission that suits it well (though it could use a 6th gear), and is reasonably torquey down low. So it’s plenty of fun.  Though it does feel a lot slower now that I’m DDing an E550 Merc.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > WilliamsSW 07/09/2020 at 10:13

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I’ve never really driven all that powerful cars so I’m not missing it. My car is a great balance between slow car fast and keeping out of its own way. The 6 speed auto really takes away a lot of the fun. With that extra driving engagement, it would be a lot more fun, so I often u se the semi auto just because it is something to do. It’s really about expectations and how hard you push it. I would probably have a lot less fun if I regularly drove a high horsepower car.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > LJ909 07/09/2020 at 10:28

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Did he test drive the damn thing...?

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Milky 07/09/2020 at 10:30

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Next they’re going to designate them by the length in Fig Newton meters.

Milky > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/09/2020 at 10:51

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Makes sense, whatever gets you the biggest number I guess.  

LJ909 > Milky 07/09/2020 at 11:17

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I don’t get it either. Especially doing it here in the US where almost no one outside of the automotive community knows what it is. Part of me actually suspects that they are counting on customers stupidity to think that that’s some kind of power rating. Like I saw an XT5 pass me on the freeway the other day and it had a 400 badge on it. 

LJ909 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 07/09/2020 at 11:18

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I’m sure he did. He just got played by the sales person purposely distracting him. He should’ve done more research. 

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > LJ909 07/09/2020 at 11:45

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Or any.